Why do people think HP is evil?

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grafix5000 Vortininja Posts: 175 (5/25/04 5:03 pm) 81.7.53.228 Reply \| Edit \| Del All	Why do people think HP is evil? Recently, a church close to the village I live in held a discussion evening entitled: "Harry Potter: A good read, or an evil influence?" and this got me thinking about why people think it will persuade people to start practising black magic. We have had fairy tales for countless years and while Harry Potter may be the most succesful, overmarketed story about magic ever, I don't believe that it could influence people that seriously. Even the diehard HP fans who buy all the merchandise, the books and everything else don't start sacrificing sheep and drawing 6-pointed stars on the floor. So what persuades people that it is evil? N.B. - I am not trying to restart the old HP "good or evil" topic, so no-one complain about this just being another copy of it, OK? If Keen eats all that sugar, why doesn't he get a coronary? goto http://www.toxicsheep.com/ to see my site!
Djaser Holy Monk Yorp Posts: 2736 (5/25/04 5:14 pm) 212.92.76.33 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Why do people think HP is evil? Deja vu It's just because Christians think that magic can only be used by God or the holy trinity and therefore any other magic like in the HP books is black and evil. That's the point basically, because the books are so populair the reaction of the churches are so extreme. ----------------- The Holy Realm The Dos Vault Forum is BACK!!! And it's here to stay.
grafix5000 Vortininja Posts: 178 (5/25/04 5:35 pm) 81.7.53.228 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Why do people think HP is evil? So why haven't they even made a minor response to other tales of magic, or have they? If Keen eats all that sugar, why doesn't he get a coronary? goto http://www.toxicsheep.com/ to see my site!
Ilsoap Flect Posts: 952 (5/26/04 7:15 am) 24.67.253.204 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Why do people think HP is evil? I do believe that there is something very dangerous about the Harry Potter series, but you're absolutely right, grafix... churches seem to have a pattern of finding one specific thing that's legitimately bad and pounding it to death, without noticing the other stuff that's in the exact same category. Why does Harry Potter get bashed when, say, Yu-Gi-Oh gets off scot-free? I don't know. Most people who read Harry Potter won't start sacrficing cats or something, just like most people who play Unreal Tournament won't go on a shooting spree. I think what concerns Christians (myself included) is that it may make people start thinking that because that book is a fantasy fiction book, that nothing supernatural is real. http://www.screenhog.com/
KeenRush Photachyon Transceiver Posts: 6032 (5/26/04 9:33 am) 212.246.17.130 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Why do people think HP is evil? ^ Hmmm, I haven't thought of that one Ilsoap.. But probably people that enjoy this kind of books and stuff think more than there is something supernatural, but they keep that as some magic world and other stuff, and forget God. Or dunno. But things that I don't like there is for example in the fifth book where Potter is talking with that ghost what happens after death and other stuff, and there's stuff like only wizards can come back as ghosts or something like that, I don't like that at all. It's the mind-belt....
Djaser Holy Monk Yorp Posts: 2739 (5/26/04 12:20 pm) 212.178.7.52 Reply \| Edit \| Del	a Churches bash HP so much because it's far more populair than other books in it genre, it's that simple.
grafix5000 Vortininja Posts: 179 (5/26/04 6:29 pm) 81.7.59.38 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Uh-oh... There is? Frantically searches through HP5 So there is. Throws plans for life after death into bin, picks up brother's copy of druid manual and starts reading If Keen eats all that sugar, why doesn't he get a coronary? goto http://www.toxicsheep.com/ to see my site!
KeenRush Photachyon Transceiver Posts: 6036 (5/26/04 6:32 pm) 212.246.17.130 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: a Hmmm, just asking curiously because I haven't ever noticed or heard about this; does many churches consider the Lord of the Rings evil? The author was quite religious man and so on, and even said that it's Christian thing to do to write fantasy fiction and enrich the stuff God created by using your imagination and creating your own imagination worlds.. :rolleys I read that from his biography or whatever a book that tells about someone's life is called.. So, is the Rings evil? There's wizards and other scary stuff. It's the mind-belt....
Ilsoap Flect Posts: 955 (5/26/04 7:58 pm) 24.67.253.204 Reply \| Edit \| Del	LOTR evil? Now you've done it, Keenrush... that's one of those debates that's pretty popular to talk about (or at least I hear about it a lot). I don't know. The only thing I know about Tolkien is that he went to church often (I think it was an Anglican church). I don't know if he actually was a Christian though. As for the books, there are a lot of people who talk about how it was all a representation of Christianity or God or something like that, but I can't see how. The whole battle between good and evil thing doesn't automatically make it godly.
KeenRush Photachyon Transceiver Posts: 6043 (5/26/04 8:28 pm) 212.246.17.130 Reply \| Edit \| Del	LOTR evil? Yep. ^ Yeah, it was Anglican or Catholic church, can't remember.. But what I remember from the book (please remember my memory is very fuzzy), Tolkien really believed God and Jesus and so on, and that probably defines him a Christian (IMKO). So. I believe that is popular debate topic, I just don't follow any debates or take part on them or anything, not to mention I've noticed any.. Anyways. Well, I've read the books only once, and won't ever read them again, so I might not remember everything. But I think same; I don't think they were about Christianity or God. Just like you said, the battle between good and evil isn't necessary related to that. Maybe there were some "references" to God or something like that; can't remember much but if I remember correct there was shortly said that some humans stared to some morning and spent some quiet moment, probably something like praying, dunno. It's the mind-belt....
CommanderSpleen Vortininja Posts: 347 (5/27/04 4:40 am) 210.15.242.68 Reply \| Edit \| Del	My toenails need clipping. The church's stance on Harry Potter is one that I still can't come to grips on at any level. Nothing about it promotes any form of so-called 'black magic'--if anything it promotes 'responsible witchcraft'. Witchcraft is a legitimate, yet incredibly misunderstood practice, and there's nothing 'immoral' about it. IMKO, Harry Potter is doing nothing but good for the general public, bringing the issues of the 'paranormal' to the forefront of our culture's awareness and keeping kids' minds open to the possibilities of the supernatural. Though as Ilsoap says, it can swing the other way and alienate the world of magic to the realm of 'Mere Imagination' (it's unfortunate that, on the whole, imagination is deemed unimportant in today's world, but that's another rant entirely). ¿ Speaking of another rant entirely, I searched for some Googleness related to J.R.R. Tolkien and the way he created Lord of the Rings, and found this article, which conveniently enough was also about game development. GS:EA In the end, Tolkien didn't really think of himself as "creating" his world, but more as bringing to light something which already existed. When someone once asked him a question about Middle-Earth for which he had no answer, he made a note in his diary: "Must find out." Not "must think of something" or "must make something up," but "must find out." Tolkien was not a novelist creating a world, he was a historian documenting one that he could see in his head. Btw: everything between ¿ and ? is besides the point. Both movies are works of 'art'. Just like Michaelangelo's David--and you don't see people running around streaking because of it, do you? Though it could make for a viable scape-goat--after all, we can blame all our problems on violence in video games and movies, why not sculptures depicting full-frontal nudity? (I know, I'm resorting to rhetoric now... I just had to use the analogy somewhere). Anyway, my point is, Xky for mayor. ? >CommanderSpleen ö Cave assectatorem Ductoris Alacris ö "The universe truly seems to be set up as a platform for the actualization of our deepest and most heartfelt aspirations. It is a dynamic system propelled by nothing less than the constant flow of small miracles. But there is a catch. The universe is built to respond to our consciousness, but it will give back to us only the level of quality we put in." - James Redfield: The Celestine Vision JimSoft Lair http://jimsoftlair.tripod.com/ Edited by: CommanderSpleen at: 5/27/04 4:41 am
grafix5000 Vortininja Posts: 180 (5/27/04 6:09 am) 81.7.63.204 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Evil capitalist swine... I thought that Harry Potter was a great idea that was actually quite new and inspirational, but now that the coporate Warner Bros. fat-cats have jumped on the bandwagon, I view it as an overmarketed, unoriginal mess. Due to time constraints, many of the best parts of the book have been stripped out, meaning that those who haven't seen the movie are missing out greatly. I actually admit to falling asleep in the middle of HP1 - I missed out the whole forest scene ! I never went to see the second movie after hearing that it was worse than the first one, and I think the third one will be even more pureed crap-in-a-bap, stewed by marketing execs until all traces of humour, passion and originality are stripped from it. Also, HP is no longer an original idea. So many books, games and TV shows have ripped it off that you can't see the book for the cheap rip-offs that can't even be bothered to change the stereotype. "Uh, boss, what are we going to print next?" "We will print another HP rip-off! Everyone loves those." "How we going to do that?" "Well, we'll just get a copy of the books, change a few words and the names of the characters, and we're done!" "Great one boss! We're going to be rich!!!" Ahem. If Keen eats all that sugar, why doesn't he get a coronary? goto http://www.toxicsheep.com/ to see my site!
RocketJess Posts: 84 (5/27/04 6:26 am) 144.137.39.219 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... Books = yay! Movies = meh All other merchandise = blah. I'm not sure why some people think HP is evil. Probably just yelling at it because it's popular. Like with Pokémon, and all the people saying it's demonic, while similar but less overmerchandised shows get away without any complaints about them. And it's not the church in general, it's only some churches that are against HP. The Salvation Army's Warcry magazine had a feature article a little while ago about HP not being evil... RocketJess, blasting off again! The Dragonkeeper's Lair
Djaser Holy Monk Yorp Posts: 2745 (5/27/04 1:18 pm) 212.92.76.33 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... *Quote:* Hmmm, just asking curiously because I haven't ever noticed or heard about this; does many churches consider the Lord of the Rings evil? The author was quite religious man and so on, and even said that it's Christian thing to do to write fantasy fiction and enrich the stuff God created by using your imagination and creating your own imagination worlds.. :rolleys I read that from his biography or whatever a book that tells about someone's life is called.. So, is the Rings evil? There's wizards and other scary stuff. You answered your own question Keenrush. I know very few Christians no matter how strict who consider Lotr as evil. And yes it's a biography. ----------------- The Holy Realm The Dos Vault Forum is BACK!!! And it's here to stay.
0 UNFLEEXABLE 0 Commodore Postpostpost Posts: 2072 (5/27/04 8:30 pm) 203.213.61.23 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... *Quote:* Why does Harry Potter get bashed when, say, Yu-Gi-Oh gets off scot-free? I don't know. Hmm... Good point. I absolutely hate those shitty animes. *Quote:* Books = yay! Movies = meh All other merchandise = blah. I have to agree with that. *Quote:* I'm not sure why some people think HP is evil. Probably just yelling at it because it's popular. Like with Pokémon, and all the people saying it's demonic Yeah, back when I was collecting them, many adults (particularly my cousin's parents), would say that Pokemon Cards influence gambling. Speaking of which... [Inserts coin into a slot machine] C'mon... Charizard! EDIT : Seriously, why the hell would a church be whingeing over a stupid children's book? That church is full of melodramic maniacs. Give 'em my regards at the next sermon. Muhuhuahahaha! > Hello Kiddies! I'm Silly the Ghost! Edited by: 0 UNFLEEXABLE 0 at: 5/27/04 8:40 pm
Flaose The Vagrant Posts: 1431 (5/27/04 10:43 pm) 68.147.109.142 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... It's a great story that's getting kids reading again. I don't see what's wrong with that. -------------------- Cerebral Cortex 314 - For All of your Commander Keen Needs. Eat at Joes
KeenRush Photachyon Transceiver Posts: 6052 (5/28/04 9:09 am) 212.246.17.130 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... Well, don't those monsters read in school enough? They should spent time with quality classic games, like Keen for example. It's the mind-belt....
Djaser Holy Monk Yorp Posts: 2746 (5/28/04 9:40 am) 212.92.76.33 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... *Quote:* Why does Harry Potter get bashed when, say, Yu-Gi-Oh gets off scot-free? I don't know. BTW that's not true, most Christians are also against that kind of manga. ----------------- The Holy Realm The Dos Vault Forum is BACK!!! And it's here to stay.
LevelLord00 Vorticon Elite Posts: 869 (5/28/04 10:56 am) 219.88.57.120 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... Yeah, but that stuff don't get ant publicity.Its in the background, but you don't see it in the papers. On a side note, HP is evil, the movies, the toys, cards, etc,etc, all designed to suck money outa gullible little kids. Ever notice that the books are getting longer? [And I know why. I wonder if Beetoven would've published more music if he had been wired up to a car battery? Het Mozart! You've got a symphony to finnish and I've got some jumper cables with your name on em!] I have two nice books, Barry Potter and the shamelss paradoy, and its sequel, Barry Potter and the unessecary sequel. Both a good laugh. See also Sluggy Freelance. "No one should be here" -Level Lord Edited by: LevelLord00 at: 5/30/04 9:24 am
Flaose The Vagrant Posts: 1432 (5/28/04 9:48 pm) 68.147.109.142 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... I take it you've never read the books. -------------------- Cerebral Cortex 314 - For All of your Commander Keen Needs. Eat at Joes
0 UNFLEEXABLE 0 Commodore Postpostpost Posts: 2077 (5/29/04 12:27 am) 203.213.80.232 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... Uh, LevelLord, the parodies are named 'Barry Trotter' not 'Harry Potter'. I've never read them, and i'm not going to, but i've seen those two books at a book store not too long ago. It seems that the parodies are pretty much summing up what happened in the Harry Potter books with the proper nouns spelt differently. Pathetic. Harry Potter is a splendid read, I had finished reading Philosopher's Stone this week for the second time, going on to the Chamber of Secrets again. I still haven't yet purchased Order of the Phoenix. $40 for a novel? Ppft! > Hello Kiddies! I'm Silly the Ghost!
Yowza Vortininja Posts: 293 (5/29/04 6:38 am) 220.244.224.10 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... My church's stance on Harry Potter is: Not evil. I don't see anything wrong with it. I mean, it's boring as all hell, but not evil.
0 UNFLEEXABLE 0 Commodore Postpostpost Posts: 2083 (5/29/04 11:33 am) 203.213.80.16 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... Well, at the mosque, we plot terrorist attacks against the US... hmmm... Muslims have no time for Harry Potter, but what we do have time for is exploring The Chamber of Weapons of Mass Destruction (soon we'll be tossing Philosopher's Stones at the White House... you have been warned) and freeing The Prisoner of the USA (Saddam Hussain) by setting the Prison on fire with the Goblet of Fire... as Ordered by... [Back to Reality, UnFleexable is at a restaurant] WAITRESS : Sir? ME : Order of Fries, Order of Fries! Geez, Hope I didn't doze off there talking to myself! Mhuauauahahhaha! > Hello Kiddies! I'm Silly the Ghost! Edited by: 0 UNFLEEXABLE 0 at: 5/29/04 11:37 am
grafix5000 Vortininja Posts: 187 (5/29/04 9:08 pm) 81.7.63.51 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... Unfleex: Unlike most parodies, they do actually have original storylines. You've obviously never read the parodies. LL: That bit about car batteries was ripped directly from the first Barry Trotter book. Shame on you. Yowza: I actually thought that the first few books were interesting, but I now think that JK Rowling has too much money to bother to write good books. Also, the books over here are far cheaper than converts dollars into pounds £21.80! Only cost us £15. If Keen eats all that sugar, why doesn't he get a coronary? goto http://www.toxicsheep.com/ to see my site!
0 UNFLEEXABLE 0 Commodore Postpostpost Posts: 2086 (5/30/04 12:51 am) 203.213.63.114 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... *Quote:* Unlike most parodies, they do actually have original storylines. You've obviously never read the parodies. That's abso-ding-dang-doodily right. I've never read it and I'm not going to, reading a single Harry Potter book is frustrating enough as it is... > Hello Kiddies! I'm Silly the Ghost!
LevelLord00 Vorticon Elite Posts: 895 (5/30/04 9:26 am) 219.88.57.3 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Evil capitalist swine... *Quote:* It seems that the parodies are pretty much summing up what happened in the Harry Potter books with the proper nouns spelled differently. Pathetic. Not really, I like the 'youthanasia' Barry having a nonmagical son Nigel, and the frequent sexual innuendo. *Quote:* WAITRESS : Sir? ME : Order of Fries, Order of Fries! Geez, Hope I didn't doze off there talking to myself! WAITRESS: Sir, you manage this restaurant. Remember, Jihad Fried Infidels? ME: Yesss, kill all the infidels with obesity! *Quote:* LL: That bit about car batteries was ripped directly from the first Barry Trotter book. Shame on you. Eeeeyuuugghh! throw your shame on someone else! yeuch! *Quote:* I've never read it and I'm not going to, reading a single Harry Potter book is frustrating enough as it is... Yeah, they only have pictures on the cover, and really long words like 'parody' [TWO syllables] AND no Pow! Smash! noises! UR A Frt Ltl Mrt Dsinhrt! "No one should be here" -Level Lord Edited by: LevelLord00 at: 5/30/04 9:35 am
grafix5000 Vortininja Posts: 190 (5/30/04 12:50 pm) 217.140.39.23 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Posts galore! It seems strange to think that this topic has had more posts and views than the second Chain Story...and I started it! (At least now you know who to blame! )
LevelLord00 Vorticon Elite Posts: 905 (5/31/04 11:49 pm) 130.217.76.32 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Posts galore! Short posts, and not as high quality. Eample: I just posted to say I think HP is evil, and because I have a big mouth. UR A Frt Ltl Mrt Dsinhrt! "No one should be here" -Level Lord
KeenRush Photachyon Transceiver Posts: 6090 (6/1/04 6:59 am) 212.246.17.130 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Posts galore! I see.. Well, probably seems this topic has been used to death. What'll be the next topic? "What do you think of Transhumanism?" http://www.transhumanism.org/index.php/WTA/index/ It's evil! It's the mind-belt....
RocketJess Posts: 87 (6/1/04 8:04 am) 144.137.39.219 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Posts galore! *Quote:* 'parody' [TWO syllables] Uh, "parody" has three syllables... RocketJess, blasting off again! The Dragonkeeper's Lair
LevelLord00 Vorticon Elite Posts: 912 (6/1/04 9:59 am) 219.88.57.112 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Posts galore! *Quote:* "What do you think of Transhumanism?" Yeah right *Quote:* Uh, "parody" has three syllables... Para-doy? = P-ara-doy? Pa-ra-doy? Parad-oy? I hate syllables, they were started in 1886 as an excuse to beat up Italians. UR A Frt Ltl Mrt Dsinhrt! "No one should be here" -Level Lord
grafix5000 Vortininja Posts: 199 (6/1/04 1:10 pm) 81.7.63.100 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Posts galore! Par-o-dy. Par-o-dy. You never did syllables in school? If Keen eats all that sugar, why doesn't he get a coronary? goto http://www.toxicsheep.com/ to see my site!
KeenRush Photachyon Transceiver Posts: 6108 (6/1/04 6:39 pm) 212.246.17.130 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Posts galore! LL, sadly or not, that Transhumanism stuff isn't joke! There even is something Finnish Transhumanism thing as well. Oh, and glad I haven't ever had those things at school. We want Keen Chronicles!
Ilsoap Flect Posts: 961 (6/1/04 8:22 pm) 24.67.253.204 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Transhumanism Transhumanism, huh? Judging from the website, it sounds like "use technology to make yourself better" which can be translated "I'm selfish". http://www.screenhog.com/
LevelLord00 Vorticon Elite Posts: 922 (6/1/04 11:37 pm) 130.217.76.32 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Transhumanism Or possibly, "Since we can make ourselves better, why not force improvement on (or better yet, destroy) those who are too stupid to improve themselves" Example: Human growth hormone, origional use, to promote growth in a small number of genetic dwarves who couldn't produce any. Current use, as a performance enhancer and to make 'short' children grow taller through years of painful forced injections. [And they have to stay on it, if they're taken off they stop growing.] Whats better, there will always be short kids! So I wonder when (not if) our ability to improve ourselves will cause people to treat those with physical and other disabilites as freaks [Lookit that cripple, moron should get a leg job!] And believe me, it will happen, how many people want GE food? [Which is already being forced apon us.] UR A Frt Ltl Mrt Dsinhrt! "No one should be here" -Level Lord
0 UNFLEEXABLE 0 Commodore Postpostpost Posts: 2097 (6/5/04 12:52 am) 203.213.53.64 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Transhumanism Here's my take on Genetically modified food... [A crazed Farmer is trying to force feed genetically modifed grass to a cow] FARMER : Eat the damn grass! COW : NNNNOOOOOOOOOOO! [A crazed zookeeper tries to force feed a lion genetically modified rat meat at a zoo] ZOOKEEPER : You pathetic overgrown cat! Eat the friggin' rat! LION : [Roars] ZOOKEEPER : [Laughs] You'll never find pure meat in this stupid prison ce- ohh... [You can assume what's gonna happen next... ] > Hello Kiddies! I'm Silly the Ghost!
LevelLord00 Vorticon Elite Posts: 962 (6/5/04 9:30 am) 219.89.1.58 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: Transhumanism WARNING! Warnung! avertissement ! GE crop, do not enter feild, do not steal, transport, damage or talk to the plants! [In biology] Okay class, who else's homework ate their dog? Next project, crossing corn with tigers to create activist resistant crops. [In the zoo] Zookeeper: Eat the damn rat! Tiger: Roar! * chomp! * Next day... Zookeeper: Eat the damn steak! Rat meat: Roar! We, Skru U inc, understand public opinion. We wish to develop GE crops to stop starvation and malnutrition. [Hows the breast enhancing wheat going? 1 billion, 2 billion, 3 billion...] UR A Frt Ltl Mrt Dsinhrt! "No one should be here" -Level Lord
Robo Blue Vorticon Elite Posts: 1079 (6/23/04 9:11 am) 24.187.180.158 Reply \| Edit \| Del	longer books are better. To get this back on topic... *Quote:* Ever notice that the books are getting longer? I think it's good that the books are getting longer. It means that the publishers are allowing the author the freedom to write how she wants. Unfortunately, a lot of publishers will refuse to publish a book unless a writer shortens it, sometimes for reasons as trivial as the price of paper.
LordOfGlobox Vortininja Posts: 271 (6/28/04 11:52 pm) 209.81.166.217 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: longer books are better. HP is not even close to being evil, I've debated with my Youth Pastor over this a few times. I personnally think the only poeple who don't like them, are the ones who haven't read them.
Too Much Spare Time King Slug Posts: 827 (6/29/04 11:34 am) 222.152.147.202 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: longer books are better. OH MY NONEXISTENT GOD! Read this Jack T. Chick comic. It's long, but the ending is SO worth it. How I did laugh! http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/5012/5012_01.asp Let's all go to Hell, chums! ---------- The Chasm of Strife (deceased): www.ThisStrife.com/Sluggy/chasm.htm
Djaser Holy Monk Yorp Posts: 2883 (6/29/04 1:09 pm) 212.92.76.33 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: longer books are better. Oh my, I expected that ending with all those bible quotes. These guys are hilarious. ----------------- The Holy Realm The Dos Vault Forum is BACK!!! And it's here to stay.
Flaose The Vagrant Posts: 1451 (6/29/04 1:59 pm) 68.147.109.142 Reply \| Edit \| Del	Re: longer books are better. Hahaha, I thought it was a joke until I got to the end! -------------------- Cerebral Cortex 314 - For All of your Commander Keen Needs. Eat at Joes

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