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Author
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Comment
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Forge315
Vortininja
Posts: 435
(12/16/01 10:23:33 pm)
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New Keen Sprite
Here?s a link to the new Keen sprite, that will be in my Keen game.
http://www.angelfire.com/games3/ckinfo/newkeen.html
I think he's better than the original.
But I would like to know, one of several things:
Should he move smoothly; something like GBC Keen?
Should he be more colorful?
Anything wrong with him?
I will start to animate him once I have some input.
The first things to be animated will be his running animation?s. If I can do those, then I will do his jumping, and falling animation?s. After that pogo and shooting, and the rest will be implemented as needed.
[Edited in order to make link clickable. -- Cho'gall]
Edited by: chogall at: 12/17/01 11:32:56 am
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Yorpy 
Vortininja
Posts: 184
(12/17/01 3:22:16 am)
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New Keen Sprite
His feet seem too big for his body to me.
I like the new coloring though. I always wondered why Keen was so pasty white. Now he looks like he has been out in the sun a little more 
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Sansaro 2001
Grunt
Posts: 1
(12/17/01 4:26:46 pm)
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Re: New Keen Sprite
first a hello to all, as i am new to the message board.
Forge315: your keen sprite looks fantastic to me. the size of keen's new shoes imo is alright, it makes your keen really look like a little boy. in fact it is the first new keen sprite i see, that i really, really like. anybody claiming a 256 colour keen couldn't look good, has been prooven wrong by you. :o)
there's only three little things i think you could revise:
- the sleeve. it looks like a part of a manga hero's armour. perhaps you shouldn't draw a full circle around it, but leave the black circle open to the chest. like in the original keen sprites
- the arms look too stiff. they make keen look like an inhibited hild. we all do know that keen isn't such, hence the name: blaze. make him look more cool...
... no, don't let him wear sunglasses! ;)
- try pushing keens head a bit forward. he's got his head far in the neck, making him look a bit anxious. if he'd offensively look forward, he'd be the brave young genius he used to be in the seven official games. :)
so far from me, bye.. :)
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aeworld
Vortininja
Posts: 142
(12/17/01 4:47:28 pm)
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-
Impressive! maybe a few modifications would be in need. try to move his shoulders a little bit down.. by a pixel or so, and just like Sansaro said, relax his hand. Maybe the shoes are too big?
if this is a 2D game your sprite is otherwise 100% ok. especially the helmet was well done. im' looking forward to your game.
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Commander Riot
Grunt
Posts: 28
(12/17/01 5:14:49 pm)
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Re: New Keen Sprite
I think it's fairly good, and it's good there's more color to his skin, but his shoes look like they're a bit to big. Good sprite though
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Forge315
Vortininja
Posts: 437
(12/19/01 12:36:06 am)
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Thanks
Thanks guys, I’ll make some of those changes.
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ChargingMoose 
Vortininja
Posts: 53
(12/19/01 1:16:35 am)
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Re: New Keen Sprite
Quote:
I always wondered why Keen was so pasty white.
It's just because Keen was made in ega. I think it would have looked a lot worse if he were yellow or red like some characters of other ega games. The ega version of Wolfenstein would have also had a pasty white hero. Take a look at this
heh
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Sansaro 2001
Grunt
Posts: 2
(12/20/01 8:54:42 pm)
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Re: New Keen Sprite
usually the skin of computer game heroes has been light red in ega games. although it would have looked quite strange for keen - somehow like he'd gotten burned by the sun, bcause of the yellow helmet, i think it is due to the fact that they needed one of the 16 colours for transparency. so the helmet includes yellow, green, white, both gray colours and cyan. the shirt has both magentas, the trousers are blue, lightblue and lightmagenta and finally the shoes are red and white. while the sprite was surrounded by a black line, only lightred and lightgreen are left for transparence. lightgreen is sometimes used for the helmet and lightred in some sprites is used for the shoes and the book. but as far as i know, they never appear together. so one of the two colours always seems to be used for transparency... but i might as well be wrong. ~8)
bye bye...
Edited by: Sansaro 2001 at: 12/20/01 3:59:07 pm
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adurdin
Vortininja
Posts: 137
(12/21/01 1:53:29 am)
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Re: transparency
Actually the transparency is stored as a separate 1-bit mask.
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Sansaro 2001
Grunt
Posts: 3
(12/21/01 11:45:11 am)
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Re: transparency
> Actually the transparency is stored as a separate 1-bit
> mask.
so there's only the artistic reason left. they obviously didn't like a sunburned keen... ;o)
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Death Saber 
Vortininja
Posts: 136
(12/23/01 3:07:24 am)
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i like it
i think the sprite looks great, what resolution are you planning to make the game in? The sprite's shoulders does look like something from a manga, but its still great. kinda reminds me of mega man
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Forge315
Vortininja
Posts: 444
(12/23/01 10:56:24 pm)
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Re: i like it
It will be, 640 by 480. I cant program yet, but I will learn over the next two years. At the end of two years, being 2004, I plan to release a one level demo. Then in 2005 the game will be released.
But I do realize people may want to use the new sprite, so I will release him this summer. Or whenever I get the time to finish him.
Still yet don’t get despaired at the thought of waiting till 2005, cause I will make smaller games in-between. The first, and maybe only, being a text based game, that will be released spring 2003; think along the lines of March 2003.
I put no promise on any of this though. Cause it all just depends on how much work I put into learning how to program.
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Sansaro 2001
Grunt
Posts: 4
(12/26/01 6:09:48 pm)
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walking without legs.../Re: i like it
> It will be, 640 by 480. I cant program yet, but I will learn over the next two years.
i am glad that you all do know how much work and planning is needed to create computer games. and everything without any idea of what programming is about! ;)
you al, shouldn't set your goals too high. a quality keen game after 2 years imo is hard to do.
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Forge315
Vortininja
Posts: 450
(12/26/01 11:12:47 pm)
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Correct
And you are completely right. So we will just have to wait. Lets put a test to it, if I can’t deliver a text based game in little more than a year; then this game will not make it’s three year deadline. It seems fair to me, because if I figured it right for the text game, then the real game should make it too.
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Sansaro 2001
Grunt
Posts: 5
(1/2/02 8:38:38 am)
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Re: Correct
in which programming language are you going to implement the games? maybe i could help a little, although unfortunately i don't know too much of the deeper system internals. anyway, for the beginning (after your text-based game works) i'd recommend visual c++ and the windows direct-x sdk to work with, as it gives you an easy way to use pageflipping and stuff. even sound should be easy implementable with it, but i'll have to find out for myself, first. (:
bye, bye... :)
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Forge315
Vortininja
Posts: 468
(1/3/02 4:18:22 am)
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Re: Correct
I am going to make it in C++, but it’s going to be DOS based. I may make it Windows though; but there’s supposedly a steep learning curve for windows programming.
Quote:
unfortunately i don't know too much of the deeper system internals.
Neither do I, but I’m not looking to control every aspect of the computer to get higher FPS. Or maybe you mean the basics of programming, knowing what will work best and using that; that’s learned over time.
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Sansaro 2001
Grunt
Posts: 6
(1/3/02 10:35:58 am)
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Re: Correct
Quote:
I am going to make it in C++, but it’s going to be DOS based. I may make it Windows though; but there’s supposedly a steep learning curve for windows programming.
making a dos-game at least you'd have:
- to control every piece of hardware by directly calling hardware-interrupts.
- control every different piece of hardware explicitly
- administrate the small memory of 640 KByte and extended/expanded/whatever memories.
- know the desired graphics and sound formats
everything of the above is more or less predefined with windows sdk or directX sdk. as these days only a very view computer gamers don't use a windows system, imo it would be foolish to create a dos-based game. it makes too much work to focus on the game itself. and although microsoft libraries are a weird thing to use, it's much easier, cheaper and faster to use these libraries, than to recreate them for yourself.
windows programming is not really difficult, you just need knowledge of the windows api. for your computergames you wouldn't really need too deep knowledge, though. you'd create one window and a directx object. then you'd need to receive messages and react to them by changing parameters, creating new screens (e. g. from easily loadable bmp/ico/cur-files) and receiving the next message. no real difference to a dos-based game, as long as your game's components don't need to be concurrent.
Quote:
unfortunately i don't know too much of the deeper system internals.
Neither do I, but I’m not looking to control every aspect of the computer to get higher FPS.
well, but that is exactly what you would need to, creating a computer game. you'd need to control the graphics interface, the sound module, even routines for realtime keyboard- and joystick input are not predefined by ms-dos. perhaps some of these are predefined by borland pascal, but the borland graphics interfaces are not made for action games, they are much too slow and e. g. don't support blitting, etc., which is essential for game programming.
Quote:
Or maybe you mean the basics of programming, knowing what will work best and using that; that’s learned over time.
there's more about that, but it's learned over the time, as you say. on the other hand it's always good to know some internals. some advise from me to you would be to learn about:
- inline functions and the difference between macros and inline functions
- the difference between macros and constant variables
- templates and the difference between macros and templates
- the difference between variables, pointers and references
- constant references as function parameters
- static members
for using classes you should know about and understand:
- inheritance
- polymorphy (oops, i this is the word the english programmers use to use... %) )
- virtual functions
- the reason why a constructor cannot be virtual
- the reason why a destructor must be virtual
- the reason, why virtual function calls are slower than non-virtual function calls
- static functions
- constant functions
- function overloading
- overloading operators
if you'd like to learn everything about c++, i'd recommend "the c++ programming language" by bjarne stroustrup. although it's sometimes really confusing, this book tells you everything you need to know.
bye, bye... (:
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Forge315
Vortininja
Posts: 474
(1/3/02 1:40:56 pm)
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:)
Thanks for the tips, I’ll use them.
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