KeenWright is being updated (at last)

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adurdin Wormouth Posts: 780 (6/4/03 7:43 am) Reply	KeenWright is being updated (at last) I was bored today (exams are still almost two weeks off, and the semester is over), so I decided to try and fix the bugs with KeenWright. After running into hassles with QB, I decided to shove it, and starting building it in VB6. Download durdin.net/andy/keen/keenwright2.zip (you'll need the VB6 Runtime if you haven't got it already (check for MSVBVM60.DLL in your Windows\System folder) to see how far I got this afternoon. What's missing so far before it is basically functional: * Saving * Creating new levels * Sprites I expect I can get those up and running tonight. Oh, to run the app, you'll need to put 1TIL0000.BMP, 2TIL0000.BMP, and 3TIL0000.BMP (It was easiest to get it up and running with bitmaps) into the same directory as the .exe. If you don't have them, use modkeen to extract them from Keen 1, 2, and 3, or get them here.
KeenRush Garg Posts: 3388 (6/4/03 2:36 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) Now that's a cool thing!! BB - CK - MR. 314
Snaily Messie Posts: 841 (6/4/03 2:53 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) While I'd have used C++/Allegro, this is nice. ________ 杓_
Frenkel Vortininja Posts: 230 (6/4/03 7:05 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) I thought you were going to port it to C . *Quote:* Now the beta 1.0 of my Keen 1-3 editor is up: it's mostly functional; the source code has more functionality but it's too big for QuickBasic to compile, so I'll have to take a few days converting it to C and then I'll make the release 1.0 version available here. In the meantime, download the 1.0 beta here! (ZIP file, 130kb) Groeten van Frenkel Visit The Official S&F Prod. Homepage
Grelphy Vortininja Posts: 303 (6/4/03 7:27 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) Wonderful! now just finish it... EDIT: I should have added: leave the tilesets as bitmaps. It makes them easier to, uh, modify... You and all those other mental wimps deserve to die! -Mortimer Mcmire in Commander Keen 3 Edited by: Grelphy at: 6/4/03 7:29 pm
adurdin Wormouth Posts: 781 (6/4/03 11:09 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) Yes, I had planned to do it in C or C++; but when it comes to putting something together quickly, VB is handier because the user interface is much easier to set up. (I could have used Delphi but I'm not quite as familiar with it). Andrew
adurdin Wormouth Posts: 784 (6/5/03 6:01 am) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) For those who didn't want to download the not-fully-working version, here's a screenshot of my progress so far:
Xtraverse Stranded Fish Posts: 2219 (6/5/03 12:20 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) Funny, I was just going to make a Windoze CK editor...anyways, looks awesome andy! Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you on experience -- Mark Twain xtravaganza: www.xtraverse.co.nr www.xtraverse.tk
XkyRauh2001 Mortimer's Right Hand Man Posts: 565 (6/5/03 9:00 pm) Reply	very nice! woah--you're even able to use new/different sprites for enemy placement! fantastic! :-D the mini-map view looks great too--helps keep track of the overall scope of the level. this is definitely going to be a huge help for all mod authors! :-) thanks so much for your hard work, Mr. Durdin! --Xky
Xtraverse Stranded Fish Posts: 2225 (6/5/03 9:12 pm) Reply	Re: very nice! BTW, what's that Total Commander 5.51 thing you've got running? Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you on experience -- Mark Twain xtravaganza: www.xtraverse.co.nr www.xtraverse.tk
Forge315 Tres-tria quindecim Posts: 1493 (6/5/03 10:35 pm) Reply	. Looks wonderful so far Andrew, Can I ask a question, will the editor have the ability to readjust the levels size as it is being made? So if an extra two tiles is needed for the left side, those can be added in. Generally this can be avoided by making the level bigger than it needs to be, but it would be a nice feature.
Keengamer Commander Keen Mad Posts: 567 (6/5/03 11:22 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) finally a easy to use keen level editor, good luck andrew! BTW: do you think you could make it with keen 4,5,6 & keen dreams support? Keengamer
adurdin Wormouth Posts: 785 (6/6/03 3:18 am) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) Xtraverse: Total Commander is a file manager, which follows the Orthodox File Manager paradigm. When you're used to the way it works (or have used a similar file manager like Norton Commander), most tasks are much more efficient than with other file managers. Explorer sucks compared to Total Commander. Forge: Yes, it will be able to resize. Resizing is really a trivial thing; the only reason that it (and a couple of other enhancements) weren't in the DOS KeenEdit/KeenWright is that I was running into memory problems with QB. Keengamer: It will not initially have Keen 4, 5, 6, or Dreams support. They may be added later, I'm not sure. I know someone else is looking at developing a Keen 4, 5, and 6 editor, so I'll wait and see what they come up with.
Keengamer Commander Keen Mad Posts: 568 (6/6/03 3:38 am) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) who is this person?
adurdin Wormouth Posts: 786 (6/6/03 8:06 am) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) Daishiva. I wrote "someone" because I couldn't remember their nick off the top of my head.
adurdin Wormouth Posts: 787 (6/6/03 12:00 pm) Reply	Re: KeenWright is being updated (at last) OK, the next early release is up: Get it now! Here's what it can do: Save, load, edit Keen 1, 2, and 3 levels (placing tiles and sprites) Resize levels Use custom-made tiles and sprites for mods. Here's what it doesn't do yet: Allow placement of switches. Allow placement of levels/teleporters on map levels. One or two other things. To set it up, use ModKeen to extract the files from Keens 1, 2, and 3. Then run KeenWright, and set the paths to point to the files you just extracted. The two big buttons at the bottom switch between Tile mode and Sprite mode (as do the two selector buttons at the right-hand side of the tile list). To place a tile, click the left or right button in Tile mode. In sprite mode, clicking the left button places a sprite; clicking the right button removes it. Use Ctrl + left or right button to "pick up" a tile or a sprite. For those of you who have made levels or mods, this is where I need some ideas: what features should the editor support? I cannot guarantee to implement all your ideas, but some of them should get implemented. Obviously, the things I mentioned as lacking will be implemented.
Forge315 Tres-tria quindecim Posts: 1494 (6/6/03 5:46 pm) Reply	Some Ideas One thing that was good about the original KeenWright, was that the perspective was like it would be in the game. The ability to zoom, or open up two windows of the same level at different aspect ratios would be a good feature. Xtraverse𠏋 later Mods used different names for the levels, anyway it would make level design easier if KeenWright could open any such and save with different names. Perhaps a tile-palette, where you predefine shapes for your levels that you can use again and again.
XkyRauh2001 Mortimer's Right Hand Man Posts: 566 (6/6/03 8:18 pm) Reply	yes TED5, for the short instances i used it, had a sort of rectangular cut and paste system, for copying squares of tile and placing them in other places (most useful for those many-tiled backgrounds or for putting a series of pseudo-3d platforms)... i doubt there's any real potential of this, but my friend CheesyDave has been fighting with TileInfo a lot lately--he's fond of rearranging his tiles to be organized to his liking for editing. unfortunately, TileInfo is finicky and often he'll create a level, discover he screwed up one tile somewhere, change his tile info, and then have to re-edit the level to replace all the changed tiles. of course there's no real way to aid with that in a level editor, but is there any documented info on which tiles are hard-coded and unable to be altered? editor looks great :-D --Xky
Forge315 Tres-tria quindecim Posts: 1495 (6/6/03 9:32 pm) Reply	. To my knowledge all tiles can be altered but some have specific uses in addition that do not change. Like the background tiles, or the falling concrete block in Keen1. You just have to keep your eyes open and test a tile whenever you suspect it to be a specific tile, it is a hassle but you only have to do it once. If you like, depending on which Keen game it is, I have a list of most of the tiles like this.
Forge315 Tres-tria quindecim Posts: 1496 (6/7/03 1:44 am) Reply	hard coded I've only worked with the tilesets of Keen1 and 3, but these should be a complete list for those. The tiles crossed out in green are hard coded as you like to call them. www.commanderkeen.net/use...emp/k1.bmp www.commanderkeen.net/use...emp/k3.bmp
Xtraverse Stranded Fish Posts: 2227 (6/7/03 2:43 am) Reply	Re: hard coded Forge, you missed the tiles that stop the arms For the flat arms, the tile that stops them is 143. For the arms with two things that hit that ground, you need a the tiles 430,471,430 in that order. Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you on experience -- Mark Twain xtravaganza: www.xtraverse.co.nr www.xtraverse.tk
Zorath Vortininja Posts: 181 (6/7/03 2:17 pm) Reply	Re: hard coded *Quote:* but is there any documented info on which tiles are hard-coded and unable to be altered? I started to write such a documentation a few months ago but never completed it, you can download the unfinished stuff here: personal.inet.fi/koti/meklund/pckf/cktiles.zip. If anyone want to finish it, feel free to do so. It has a description of most "hard-coded" or "special" tiles in Keen 1 and 2 but I didn't start writing the Keen 3 section. There may be a few, or maybe many, errors in the documentation. I think there's a small error in my Keen 1 tileset image, I marked the bridge tile as non-hard-coded, but I think you actually can get them into the game by doing something weird with switches... I may be wrong. Oh, it also includes a empty tileinfo file for Keen 1 if anyone want to make a new tileset from scratch. Edited by: Zorath at: 6/7/03 2:20 pm
Zorath Vortininja Posts: 182 (6/7/03 2:46 pm) Reply	Re: Some Ideas Now about the editor, It looks great! The ability to easy change the tileset and now also sprites without having to use Tileinfo every time is really good. *Quote:* For those of you who have made levels or mods, this is where I need some ideas: what features should the editor support? I cannot guarantee to implement all your ideas, but some of them should get implemented. Obviously, the things I mentioned as lacking will be implemented. I should want the fill, rectangle and draw line options from your earlier version of the editor, and a copy function should also really be cool, but maybe not as useful. Also the status page in the older editor that showed how many enemies and item objects there was in the level was a really good feature, but now, when we have Tileinfo, there's a problem when people can move the point tiles anywhere they want in the tileset... Another thing I should want is an option that sets the tile selector window to a width of 13 tiles so it's easier to find tiles in the tileset (this can already be done by resizing the level window, but that's not really a good way to do it). *Quote:* One thing that was good about the original KeenWright, was that the perspective was like it would be in the game. The ability to zoom, or open up two windows of the same level at different aspect ratios would be a good feature. I agree, that was one of the really good things with the old editor, if you have your resolution in Windows set to something really big, all the tiles becomes very small. A zoom feature, or an option that should make all the tiles twice as big should be useful. A question: When editing a Keen 3 level, in the sprite selector, there's 3 Keen sprites at the end - why? - Zorath
Xtraverse Stranded Fish Posts: 2228 (6/7/03 2:53 pm) Reply	Re: Some Ideas Something weird..I have to reset the paths to the different modkeen files every single time a load the editor, it's rather annoying. Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you on experience -- Mark Twain xtravaganza: www.xtraverse.co.nr www.xtraverse.tk
Forge315 Tres-tria quindecim Posts: 1501 (6/8/03 12:27 am) Reply	thanks Thanks Xtraverse, I'll fix it later.
adurdin Wormouth Posts: 789 (6/8/03 12:38 am) Reply	Re: thanks OK, some good ideas there... zooming is already possible (I planned for it, but just haven't got buttons for it there). The sprite selectors will contain some sprites that are modified or drawn from scratch by the editor code: that is, in Keen 1 the four ice cubes (or whatever they are changed to be) will have arrows superimposed on them, ditto the platforms in Keen3. And the final three sprites in Keen3 are for the legs and arm of the mangling machine -- they'll end up looking like they did in the old version, I expect, but I hadn't got round to that yet. I'll make a list of all these suggestions (and keep giving more), prioritise them, and work on them as I can. Another feature of this editor will be switches: which will have a visible line pointing to the place where the bridge ends up.
Forge315 Tres-tria quindecim Posts: 1504 (6/8/03 1:30 am) Reply	goodie KMO might have had this, but being able to place the level entry codes, at least their defaults, from a list would nice. It could be under a list of miscellaneous things, like the portal codes in Keen3. I got a list of all the portal links, for Keen3, maybe put them up later.
KeenRush Garg Posts: 3402 (6/10/03 2:15 pm) Reply	Re: goodie Wow, those new features sound really cool! BB - CK - MR. 314
The Phantom Blob Grunt Posts: 9 (6/11/03 1:16 pm) Reply	Re: goodie WHY doesn't the goddamned program RUN?!?!? I put the pathes in: C:\keen\1 C:\keen\2 C:\keen\3 BUT THEY WON'T WORK! WHY??!?!? All of the BMP files are in the maps: C:\keen\1\1TIL0000 C:\keen\2\2TIL0000 C:\keen\3\3TIL0000 What's wrong with that?! AARRGHH!!!! Mort: [Edited by Cho'gall: Swearing is not allowed, even if you replace the vowels in the swear word with asterisks.] Edited by: chogall at: 6/11/03 9:57 pm
Xtraverse Stranded Fish Posts: 2236 (6/11/03 1:33 pm) Reply	Re: goodie I told you in the other post you made, you need the sprite files modkeen creates as well. Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you on experience -- Mark Twain xtravaganza: www.xtraverse.co.nr www.xtraverse.tk
The Phantom Blob Grunt Posts: 10 (6/11/03 3:22 pm) Reply	Re: goodie D'OOOOH I really don't get how modkeen works and I'm losing my temper too, sorry about that nothing personal.
Matze82 Meep Posts: 3 (8/4/03 10:02 am) Reply	Re: Some Ideas You editor is quite fine, but I like the DOS KeenWright a bit more. I'm using Windows NT 4.0 and especially Keen 1-3 don't run that good under Win NT, the game is going slower and the pc-speaker sonnds badly. Additonally I cant't update my Keen2.exe to version 1.31... Therefore im using MS-DOS 6.22 (my second system on my pc) for keening. I would suggest to do the stuff with the paths to the modkeen files using an .ini file. Do you know how this works in VB? I think I could help you at this point Matze*
adurdin Wormouth Posts: 820 (8/5/03 7:24 am) Reply	Re: Some Ideas It currently stores stuff in the registry using VB's built-in registry functions, but they're pretty crufty, and don't appear to work reliably. I was going to change it to use .ini files, but I haven't been able to spend any more time working on the program for a while. Andrew